There are conversations that feel like they’re about one thing, but they’re actually about something else entirely. This one starts with laughter… and ends up in a tender place.

Ryan Shelton is such an excellent human. He’s one third of The Imperfects alongside Hugh and Josh van Cuylenburg, and a face on Australian screens for the better part of two decades, from Rove to Hamish & Andy. I knew going into this chat that it’d be warm and funny and real.

We talk about what it costs to keep seeking approval, the psychology behind why so many of us are still waiting for someone to say “it’s your turn now,” and the surprising power of small, silly, seemingly pointless things. Ryan’s beautiful quote – delivered with perfect comic timing and complete sincerity – might be my favourite callout from the whole season so far: “Silliness is worth taking seriously.”

We explore:

• The fear that stops you putting creative work into the world – and what actually happens when you finally do it anyway
• “Juvenile condition” – the Adlerian psychology concept that explains why so many adults are still waiting for permission to start their own lives
• Laughter as a nervous system response – and why it shows up in the strangest, most inconvenient moments
• The “three-sided column” from The Courage to Be Happy – and how it changes who you think is responsible for your life
• Why silliness might be the most underrated form of connection and healing we have right now

During lockdown, Ryan set himself a project – releasing something creative, something silly, on the 11th of every month, just to keep making things. He named his recent art exhibition All This Work, Just For This. And I think that says it perfectly.

All the fear, the procrastination, the need for approval. The creativity, the silliness, the courage it takes to put something out there, even when you’re scared. Ryan reminded me to take that a lot more seriously – and to laugh a lot more while I’m doing it.

About Ryan Shelton:

Ryan Shelton is one of Australia’s most beloved comedians and writers. After two decades in Australian television – from Rove Live to co-writing Chris Lilley’s We Can Be Heroes and producing Hamish & Andy’s The Gap Year, True Story, and Perfect Holiday – he’s now one third of The Imperfects, Australia’s leading mental health podcast, alongside Hugh and Josh van Cuylenburg. During Covid, he ran ryyyyyyyyyyyan.com, releasing 22 creative pieces on the 11th of every month. In late 2025, he opened his debut solo art exhibition in Fitzroy: All This Work, Just For This. He takes silliness very, very seriously. Exactly as it should be.

Connect with Ryan:

• Instagram: @ryansheltonography
• The Imperfects Podcast: Listen on Apple Podcasts
• That film Ryan mentions: Toni Erdmann – a deeply funny and unexpectedly moving German film about a father who uses silliness to try to reconnect with his daughter.

Also in this episode:

@fullmhouse – joyful American family. Five kids, Try on Tuesdays, and a couple who spend most of their videos just falling on the floor laughing together. If your soul needs some lightness today, this is a very good place to start!